Episode 18
WITS chats Captain America | Brave New World
Rebecca and Tori chat about their initial reactions to the new Captain America movie, including character utilization and the connections to the broader Marvel universe. We manage to get some Shakespeare into the discussion. Tori apologizes for mispronouncing Giancarlo Esposito's first name; it made Rebecca mispronounce it as well. Tori blames her Spanish lessons.
Music
Apache Rock Instrumental by Sound Atelier licensed through Jamendo Music.
The Epical Trailer: Music by Dmitrii Kolesnikov free on Pixabay
Record Scratch: Sound Effect free on Pixabay
Sources
Transcript
Welcome to Wallowing in the Shallows, the podcast that skirts the perilous drop-off of a deep dive into television and movies. Today on Wallowing in the Shallows...
And Red Hulk, I thought he looked really good. Do you kind of wonder, I mean, imagine yourself getting Red Hulkified, you know, I wonder if Harrison Ford was at all like, wow, I look like a real bad ass.
I thought he did too. I thought he did too.
Tori (:Hey hello peeps, welcome to wallowing in the shallows, this is Tori.
And this is Rebecca. We are academic nerds aspiring to become TV and movie geeks.
There are no spoiler guards in the shallow, so listen at your own risk.
Today we are chatting about Captain America, Brave New World, which Tori and I just left. So the takes are hot.
Tori (:freshity fresh fresh fresh. And we've done no research to see what other people have said about it or anything.
Exactly.
Rebecca (:Yeah, tried very hard to not be spoiled in any way.
Yep. Yep. Yeah, I think I saw the teaser trailer and that was it. So nothing beyond that. So you tried YouTube, you tried to spoil things for me, but you didn't succeed.
Bye.
Rebecca (:think we also did a really good job getting there as fast as we could. You know, not waiting for even a week to pass.
Very true. That was my Valentine's Day, people.
Nothing wrong with that. Happy Galentine's Day!
Rebecca (:Okay, first slightly tangential question, but core to the title. When you see the words, Brave New World, so this is Captain America, Brave New World, what comes to your mind first when you? Okay, okay. Yes, so he wrote the novel Brave New World. Did you know that that comes from an earlier quote?
Thanks.
Tori (:Mm-hmm.
Tori (:Aldolphus Huxley?
Rebecca(:Brave new world that has such people in it is Miranda in the Tempest Shakespeare. So I was very excited. love what I love to play the Tempest and I love Miranda. And I think that's a really cool line. The Tempest actually has a ton of quotes that as you're reading it, you're like, my gosh, that's from this.
Tori (:Well, having never seen a good production of The Tempest, remember no lines because I'm sitting there the whole time going, holy crap, this is awful. One of these years.
Rebecca (:I I know. One of these years, we're gonna get an amazing one because that is number three. That's my third, as you know, third favorite play. Trying to find a good one and we're having a hard time. But anyway, we can't force the director to make smart choices about Ariel.
Oooooooo
I didn't even know the line, I just remember it up there.
Yeah, no, know that's all that's she did that's all she did
So, Captain America.
Rebecca (:Captain America, Brave New World, it immediately, positively disposed me to it with the inclusion of Brave New World. What do you think? Shall we begin with just sort of an instant reaction?
Sure, we can do that. Why don't you go ahead and start us off?
Okay, we'll do. So I enjoyed it. I did think it maybe got, there was a little place somewhere in the middle that I felt got a little long. I can't really tell you exactly where, but it started strong and ended strong for sure. I felt like there were some people who kind of were underutilized.
Ah, hello Juan Carlo
Yes, number one, Juan Carlo, who I thought was fantastic. I thought huge ad.
Tori (:And good looking, man, he's just a good looking man. Such. Yeah.
I mean, when you eat green presents, this is him. And I enjoyed Anthony Mackie. I do have questions for you, given the shoes he is filling, of course, but I thought he did a nice job. yeah, Juan Carlo, I just felt there could have been just more. And honestly, Red Hulk, I felt like there could have been more Red.
Tori (:Yeah.
I mean, it was one big battle, but it's like, you know, now he's in prison. So those are two. And honestly, I would not have minded seeing more of Ruth kicking butt. I'm glad we got to see what we did because I thought that that was very cool. So now, so I guess you might ask, well, who was over-utilized? mean, who would you have thrown out?
Right.
Rebecca (:you know, in order to make time for these other pieces. And I don't, don't really have a good answer, but there it is. I just felt there was some under-utilization.
Yeah, I think so too. Particularly, are we ever going to see him again? The, what was his name? Sidewinder?
Yes, that's his that says, you know, I thought they called him more than one thing, but Sidewinder is how he's referred to an IMDb.
Okay. Yeah, I would have liked to seen a lot more of him. yeah, but I also, they would have had to, I think maybe, what could they have cut? What could they have cut?
Well, we've only seen it once, I think there was probably places that could have gotten trimmed up a little.
Tori (:Yeah.
Tori (:Well, is it going to be my favorite Marvel movie? No. I did like it, but I also think you can see some of the production difficulties, right? mean, they reworked the script. I don't know how many times I felt like every time I signed onto YouTube for like the last year, it's like, they're reshooting. had to rewrite some of the script or this didn't go down well with the test audience. So they're redoing it. And so I think that.
Mm-hmm.
Tori (:The issue is apparent in the movie, but it also didn't stop me from enjoying it, right? I was entertained. That's what I want to be when I go to a movie. And anything above entertainment to me is a bonus. So, and there were a few things that I really appreciated about it, in particular, some of the references to other Marvel properties that I didn't think were ever going to be coming back at all.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Tori (:particularly the Tiamut, you know, the celestial island. that brought in, you know, it made a connection to the eternals. And I was like, wow, they're using Tiamut. That's excellent. Had no idea. And I actually do want to go do some research on this, that the core of Tiamut is adamantium.
Holy cow about that. Because isn't adamantium what? No.
Yes? Wait. Yes?
Wolverine? Okay, okay. Wow.
Yeah!
Tori (:Who knew adamantium was stronger than vibranium?
Vibranium? Hmm, not me.
Yeah, I didn't either. So that was all some kind cool stuff. I was like, holy shit. And you know, since there's this big fight, you everybody wants to control the adamantium. You know, it makes sense that the military got a hold of it and started to do experimentation. And that's why Wolverine has adamantium skeleton.
Yeah.
Tori (:So anyhow, yeah, I thought that was kind of cool. I'm like, hey, something explained for me.
Yeah, really not. I agree with the Tiamat. Quick question for you. Is it Tiamat's head and hands sticking out? Yes. Okay. Okay. Great. I just, I remember that, you know, I only saw Eternals once, but so the details are foggy. But I did know, I did know Tiamat was in the center. I just didn't know if that was like a...
if that was like a leftover from some battle and Tiamat was like deeper inside.
Well, Tiamat was in the earth, right? And so the Eternals were supposed to be here on earth to facilitate his birth, which would have destroyed earth. But they stopped it instead. But he was on his way out of the middle of the earth.
Yes.
Rebecca (:So that was the battle and he was getting out and he was stopped and now he's just sort of frozen in the middle of the Indian Ocean in entombed.
Right. Right. You know, and if we think about that in a geopolitical sense, not that I know a lot about geopolitics, but you know, the middle of the ocean, that's free reign, right? That's not any particular country. So I can see how, if there was something like that that happened, that yeah, it would create some, you know, interesting interactions between different governments.
Good point.
Tori (:Mm-hmm.
Rebecca (:So I have a lot of questions, but did you want to go in with any other references that you enjoyed seeing to other properties?
All right.
Tori (:I liked that there was a reference back to the original Hulk movie with Ed Norton, because I really, I don't know why people don't like that movie. I liked that movie. I thought it was good. And Liv Tyler does her little appearance. And I thought maybe they would just got her voice or had somebody doing her voice for that one phone call with her daddy. But they brought that, or they actually had her. So that was kind of surprising. And I liked that.
I mean, because every time we've seen the Hulk since the second Hulk movie, he's just always been with the Avengers. So was kind of nice to see some references from both of the Hulk movies, right? Because Tim Blake Nelson and as Dr. Stern comes back. And I liked that they made references back to the Falcon and the Winter Soldier.
television series, right, with having Isaiah Bradley, who I love, Carl Lumley. Love him.
And so Bucky and Isaiah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I was glad to see some of that. And also the Joaquin, he was in Falcon and the Winter Soldier as well.
Rebecca (:That was one of my questions. I did not remember him.
Yeah, he's not in a lot, but he is in some of the military scenes. Like, I don't know if you remember when Sam's going to try to rescue some people and he's like jumps out of a helicopter and the army guys are like, you can't go past that mark. Remember? Because that's forbidden airspace or whatever. That's not what they called it. But so he's in that scene and he helped Sam put his
suit back together again after it gets all mucked up. yeah. Is any of that ringing a bell? Okay. So yeah, those were some of the big ones.
little bit.
Rebecca (:still can't conjure that person in mind, but sure, I believe he was there.
Well, and of course, there is a black widow.
loved, loved this character.
They brought up the red room, was like, what the hell?
Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I was, I wasn't sure if she was going to be good or bad. And I loved how she turned out to be kick ass.
Tori (:Yeah, absolutely. Because I was like, my gosh, she's from the Red Room? she going to... I thought maybe she was going to be kind of like a double agent and she was planted in there and was going to actually turn out to be one of the bad people's.
Totally. This was a huge ad. I really hope we see her again. I thought she was great and I loved both her and Red Wing are like these dynamite comes in small packages that just are almost like indispensable. I mean, that Red Wing for Captain America is clutch.
Yeah.
Yeah, you know, and when the two red wings got destroyed, I was like, no.
So, well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you know, they got the reference back to The Raft. That's been in several movies. So, yeah, there were just all sorts of little things in there that I liked. But I was happy that we got some connection back to The Eternals, because I kind of thought that was just going to be a one-off. And outside of what if we'd never, you know, see anything again. and there was actually...
Rebecca (:They'll be back.
Tori (:I know if it was meant to be, there was a part when Red Hulk was out that made me think of She-Hulk.
Okay.
You know when he does the Hulk clap? And I remember that she was having a hard kind of having a hard time with that at first. And I was like, well, Red Hulk didn't have any problem with the Hulk clap.
yeah.
Rebecca (:No, he didn't. And Red Hulk, I thought he looked really good.
I thought he did too. I thought he did too.
Do you kind of wonder, mean, imagine yourself getting red hulkified. You know, I wonder if Harrison Ford was at all like, wow, I look like a real bad-ass.
No.
Tori (:Yeah, I would imagine.
Yeah, mean, totally ripped. Again, the age old question, how do the pants stay on? But, you know, we don't ask.
Mm-hmm.
Tori (:such things. exactly. Yeah, those were some of the things I really appreciated.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
connecting things together. And you know, I appreciate you saying that because sometimes, and I've mentioned it on various podcasts, it's just like the proliferation of the world, right? Can get a little dizzying and like, my gosh, yet another batch of characters and now another universe to learn or whatever. And so it's really nice when something ties together, something
to something already established. really appreciate that.
Right. You know, one of the things that I want to do is a little bit more research on has to do with Bucky. I guess he's running for Congress.
Rebecca (:Okay, I wondered if I'd missed something. That was one of my questions was did we have that established earlier that he was suddenly this politician? I did not. That was totally news to me.
not that I'm aware of. fact, you know, I wonder how many, how much time do you think has lapsed in the universe between Falcon and the Winter Soldier and the movie?
Great question. That'd be cool to know.
Because it's at least a couple years, I think. So a lot of could have, a lot of could have.
Mm-hmm.
Rebecca (:Mm-hmm, a lot of could've. Clearly he's had time to get his vibranium upgrades on his outfit.
could have, a lot of could have.
Tori (:Yes, holy cow. Yeah. All right. Let's see
I liked that connection as well to Wakanda.
Yes, yes. I guess they didn't tell him that the more energy that goes into the vibranium, it just kind of like soaks it all up and becomes better. Beta beta beta. Looking, looking, looking, looking, looking, looking, looking. As Brave New World builds on the events of The Falcon and The Winter Soldier, it will also become the first MCU movie to serve as a direct sequel.
Yeah.
Tori (:to one of the Marvel's Disney Plus series. Okay, that doesn't help me. Come on. Come on, come on, come on. Wow, Harrison Ford's 82. I did know that. When Ford was asked by Variety about the motion capture work that was required for him to become the Red Hulk, the 82 year old actor gave the exact kind of response you'd probably imagine. What did it take? It took not caring, Ford quipped.
it took being an idiot for money, which I've done before. I don't mean to disparage it, I'm just saying you have to do certain things that normally your mother would not want you to do, or your acting coach if you had one. But it's fun and I enjoyed it.
you know, I thought there was going to be more with that Secret Service agent as well. His kind of number one, but that kind of fell flat too. I like her and I thought she was doing a good job. I wonder if it's connected to exactly what you were describing, these rewrites and stuff. Maybe some things changed and.
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
Tori (:Okay, well, it's six years after the Avengers broke up following the defeat of Thanos and Tony's death. it doesn't. And I actually, you know, they give you a little teaser, right? Ross is like, put the Avengers back together. Yes. a new Avengers. And then of course it comes back up right at the end of the movie, but we do it. That's about it. It's just a big tease. So this doesn't help me.
Okay, that's helped.
Rebecca (:So who would this Avenger group be? Clearly Captain America and... Spider-Man?
Thor. Maybe Bucky. There's still Thor. And Bruce is still out there.
Do you think maybe our girl could take the lighthouse place?
Ruth? Scarlet? Maybe. Let's see. New Avengers team. Who is it in the comics? Well, I think shehulk maybe was going to be, but I don't know. I mean, it'd be terrible not to use her again. Well, there's Wong, there's Shang-Chi. Dr. Strange is still around. War Machine.
Mmm.
Tori (:Mm-hmm.
Okay?
You know, Don Cheadle's character. Ironheart. I mean, I'm pretty sure Spider-Man's gonna be in it. But you know, you've got the Marvels. Captain Marvel, we've got Ms. Marvel, and we've got Monica Rambeau.
Yes!
Rebecca (:Wow, plenty of.
guy. Either the Hawkeyes. Yeah, I know. know. Ant-Man and the Wasp are still running around out there.
Boy, Ant-Man really got some mentions.
Yeah. Peter Quill, Star-Lord's still out there, Black Panther. Well, it could be, right? Because we still have a Black Panther. There's a lot of people that could possibly be in it.
Okay, okay, well cool.
Tori (:So I guess time will tell. So, did you catch the big historical reference in there?
No
Tori (:Okay,
It was during the... It was when the two planes went rogue and were firing on the Japanese.
Okay.
And I didn't, of course I couldn't rewind it, which I would have done if I was at home. But I caught one of the Japanese pilots referred to Yamamoto.
Does that name ring a bell?
Rebecca (:Gosh, was that a general or something in world?
Yeah. Yep.
Help me out though. I bet you have a little more specifics there.
Well, he led the attack on Pearl Harbor.
Okay.
Tori (:Interesting. And he was at the Battle of Midway. So yeah, he was a major player. He was like the Admiral.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
of their fleet.
Good catch, good catch.
Tori (:I was like, whoa, again, this is why I would have rebounded. I'm like, why are they referencing Yamamoto? Was that the name of the ship? Which in and of itself is rather an interesting name.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
And of course, is a big stretch because Japan doesn't have its own Navy anymore, does it?
Not that I thought that was part of World War II, the treaty.
Yeah, yeah.
Rebecca (:You know, it was interesting to me that it was China, that it was Japan and not China.
Hmm, yeah, yeah.
Could have been both.
Good to bed. Good to bed.
You just have to imagine that China'd be interested. Maybe not interested in talking to us, but interested.
Tori (:Well, maybe that had some political sensitivity that they didn't want to get into at all.
Yeah.
Yeah, I can, I can tell. So they went with the French and India. Yeah. Yeah, it's true. Wasn't even like Great Britain was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was, representative countries from, you know, shoot, throw darts at a board.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
The mind control thing was interesting and I thought, well, it's going to be winter soldiery or super soldiery with that mind control that the Russians did. But interesting that it was the light and the music. I wonder if they used the light to program people, but it was the music that triggered them.
Tori (:Mm-hmm.
Rebecca (:That's, I think that's, I think that's exactly what it
Do you remember what the song was? I recognize it but I can't remember it now.
shoot. I want to say like blues was in the title.
Wasn't it something from like the 50s or 60s?
Definitely. that's gonna bother me.
Rebecca (:Hmm.
I know it's gonna drive me crazy too now. I'd be like, uh. Oh, this is interesting. I'm sorry, I'm on IMDB. was looking for some of the music things. But this says Sidewinder was added to the film during reshoots.
well what an ad.
Yeah!
What an ad.
Tori (:Interesting, okay.
Yeah, he's just he's always such an ad Captain America Soundtrack? Okay, Mr. Blue by the Fleetwoods
Okay.
But I think that's the one. thought blue was in it.
Yes, I did remember that and I knew it wasn't Mr. Blue Sky. Yeah. So I thought the movie had a bit of a slow start. I mean, I know it's supposed to be an action film, but it really felt more like well, actually, when I was sitting in the theater, I was trying to think about how would I characterize this? Because I didn't it didn't really come across as an action film, even though there were action sequences in it.
Rebecca (:Hmm.
Tori (:It was almost, sometimes I was like, well, it's kind of suspense, but not really suspense, a little bit thriller maybe, but not horror thriller or anything like that. How would you categorize it?
Good question. Because yes, it had some action sequences, but wasn't total action. And it was certainly, I don't know if I want to say origin story, but it really was the Sam Wilson fully embracing and you know, so much so that he's got a sidekick, right?
someone who looks up to him, embracing this role, questioning, should I really have this role? And having the previous holders, Bud, Bucky, bolstering him up and being like, no, man, you're the guy. He did not make a mistake, you're the guy. it's not origin story, but it's related to that.
Yeah.
Tori (:Well, I thought it was right because we really kind of see the origin exactly. This is right. And so this one is it's kind of like Sam coming to believe in himself in this role. Right. Because clearly, I mean, as you mentioned, Bucky had to bolster him up and so forth. But and I kind of you asked me earlier, you mentioned something earlier about, you know, him stepping in.
Tori (:to my boy's shoes. And I like that they didn't try to make him into Chris Evans as Captain America. so I thought it was great that they really played to Sam's strengths. I could have done a little bit less with the counseling pieces. I did have a little bit of a hard time thinking he talked Red Hulk down so quickly, but
Yes.
Tori (:I know that's just a movie thing. Time is of the essence. But I liked that at the end, right, when Joaquin and he were talking in the hospital and Joaquin's like, you know, I wanted to be a hero. And you can tell Sam's like, he's going to say like, you know, Cap or like Tony or somebody like that. And he's like, no, I just want to be you. So I think that is what this whole movie really is, right?
Yeah.
Tori (:Yeah, Sam's doing the job, but he's still got a lot of self-doubt about it. And so I like that they played to his strengths and, as I said, didn't try to make him into Chris Evans as Captain America, or they didn't try to make him into Steve Rogers. really what I should be saying. They didn't try to make him into Steve Rogers. And that was smart.
Yeah.
Rebecca (:Yeah.
And I think it makes him very relatable.
Yeah.
To us mere mortals. You know, he's just a human guy out there. Yeah, he's got some kick-ass equipment that's helping him and he's got some great training. But you know, he's one of us. And he's out there kicking ass, taking names. And I liked that he has a lot of integrity, doesn't abandon his people. He wants to support them. And those are all qualities that we love in CAP.
right? And Steve Rogers. And so Sam has those like Steve did, but he does his own thing about them. Did that make sense?
Rebecca (:yeah. Has shares some qualities, but they're not forcing the peg, right? They're, they're letting him be who he is. And yes, he naturally shares some qualities with Steve Rogers, but he brings his whole rest of himself to the role as well. So.
Right.
Tori (:Right. Yeah. Right.
Yeah, I would agree. I would agree. Okay.
So yeah, I liked Falcon and the Winter Soldier, again, not as much as I liked some of the other series, but in the back of my mind, I'm always like, I don't know, is he gonna be able to pull it off? Is he gonna be able to pull it off? And I think he did.
Did a good job. think that is high praise coming from you because of how much of a Chris Evans is portrayal of Captain America that you are. So nice, nice work. I've forgotten his name for the moment. Nice work, Anthony Mackie. If you've got Tory, you've done a good job.
Yeah.
Rebecca (:Anthony Mackie.
Tori (:Well, I look forward to see how he does in the next one. Because he should be even kind of better, right? And not just, I mean, I'm talking about Sam being better as Captain America, because he should now know that, you know, people want him to be Captain America and Cap didn't make a mistake when he gave the shield to him.
As he continues to own it and really embrace the role completely.
Yeah, exactly. Exactly.
Anything else you have to say about that? Okay, no.
I'm done with that, thank you.
Rebecca (:Do you have any thoughts that somehow Liv Tyler was going to be in that cherry blossom boulevard and seeing her was going to be what brought Red Hulk back to himself?
Did that cross my mind?
That's what I'm wondering if it crossed your mind
No, no, only because I mean, guess if she had been in Washington, maybe, but everything was happening pretty fast. I mean, they would have really had to get her there like lickety split transport, know, beam me up Scotty kind of thing to get her there in time.
They just, yeah, they would have had to do things a little bit differently. It was really kind of crazy how quickly, I had a little struggle with him stopping himself from turning into Red Hulk on the ship. But then during this press conference, right after he's had a pretty reconciling type phone call with his daughter, that suddenly he hulks out.
Rebecca (:slightest, you know, question about him being behind this, everything. So it was a pretty big accusation. mean, all true, but he brought himself back on the ship and he really blew it here. But I guess each dose was even more gamma. So he was really getting to boiling point perhaps.
And on national television.
Tori (:Yes. Yeah. Should have stopped taking the pills. I was so kind of surprised about, cause I was wondering like, well, why, how did he get hooked up with Stern? And so I was glad that they provided that explanation. I'm not gonna, I'm actually not going to spoil it for people. But I was glad they didn't just leave us hanging with that. Cause that would have pissed me off. You know what else pissed me off?
idiot that carted me to get into the DM Theater.
Like, did you hear me go, what, the gray hair didn't cure you
You know, I think probably his, his instructions are probably to card and.
I know. But it's like, come on.
Rebecca (:No.
Right, back on target here.
You know what surprised me? You've seen Independence Day. Okay. You know, when the White House got blown up in that movie, I was really upset. It did not upset me so much today.
I'm sorry, I don't mean to laugh.
But I did I did go not the Washington
Rebecca (:Agreed. That was egregious. I thought it was going to fall over. Boy, those hulks are destructive.
Yeah.
They are. are. Do you think... I was having a little debate with myself in the theater. I was like, would the Secret Service really just start shitting them? Even though they know, I mean, yeah, he's now the Red Hulk, but it's still the President.
Rebecca (:I know. thought the same thing. And I was also like, don't we just need to calm him down? Shooting him. Well, and for another thing. So the bullets, right? I did like how they sort of showed how the bullets, how, just impervious he was to the bullets. It was a little surprising to me that bullets at high velocity, nothing, but Sam's
Yeah.
Rebecca (:little, I don't know, feather, feather shards or whatever embedded themselves in his skin.
you
Tori (:I guess it's that vibranium. Well, I was trying to figure out why the hell there was this big explosion when he stabbed him with the wing. I'm like, why did everything just explode?
again.
Rebecca (:Hadn't he kind of gotten all charged up from being attacked? Like you were saying that the more energy in, the more it sort of blows back out.
Well, but why would stabbing it into flesh create something explosive like that? Unless it somehow reacted with the gamma in his body. I don't know. I was trying to figure it out. I'm like, what the hell? Where does this explosion come from? It seemed like a gratuitous explosion.
Ha ha ha ha!
Rebecca (:I'm not gonna rule that out, I'll tell you what.
Tori (:I'm like, okay, whatever, whatever. And you know, I'm a little bit tired of this love conquers all theme. You know, Sam talks him down by referencing his daughter. I'm like, come on, come on, can we not go here, please?
It holds together logically though. mean, right? This is his whole reason for trying to be better. He might've just gone quietly into the night, right? With this heart condition. If it hadn't been for, I've got to prove to my daughter that, you know, I'm a good person.
His raison d'etre
Rebecca (:Yeah.
Sorry, Betsy. Is it Betsy or Betty? Betty?
Betty. And the song, I do realize people, the song is Benny and not Betty.
I thought you were doing an Aerosmith song because Steven Tyler is her dad.
no, no, no.
Rebecca (:Lots of of ways to go there.
No. No.
I did like the shot right after he turns into Red Hawk and they're smashing up the White House and he's on top of the White House and the flag is behind him. I thought that was a great shot.
He used the flagpole!
And then he used the flag. I was like, that's an inappropriate use of old glory.
Rebecca (:gonna disagree, but Red Hulk, Red Hulk, don't give a damn.
That is true. Yeah, he was a little honey badger out there. was!
He was totally a... Honey badgers don't give a shit!
Tori (:I haven't seen that video in such a long time. Such a film.
video. I could have watched that right after.
Tori (:I was glad when they were bringing Isaiah out. And they bring him out into the foyer of the prison. And I'm like, are they going to make him go out in that damn orange jumpsuit? So yay to Ruth for bringing him.
Ruth just rocked!
Yeah, I hope she shows up again. like-
I really do too.
And I want Lachim
Rebecca (:She, well, I like him too, but not as much as her. She really made an impression on me. I think she knocked it out of the park with that.
Yes. Yeah, she's good. I hope we see her again.
I'd like to know if she's had any interaction with Black Widow or sisters, you know, or her sister.
Yeah, yeah. Boy, wouldn't that be kind of cool to see her meet up with Ms. Pugh's character, whose name I just totally forgot.
Yeah.
Rebecca (:And I told, you know, in fact, when they were busting out and well, okay. So they busted in and found Stern. Sterns? Sterns. Sterns. When they'd sort of left big brain behind, but all of the, all the kind of army guys were attacking them. And then she was on the other side of it.
At first, I wasn't sure if she was with them or against them. Then I was like, She's like, I've got these guys. And she single-handedly kicked a lot of us.
Well, it was a little bit reminiscent of Black Widow in the second Iron Man when she's with Happy and they're in that hallway and she's like kicks ass with all these guys.
Love a boss, girl.
Yeah!
Rebecca (:You gotta see bodies. She is really good in it.
Okay, well, I'll see if I can find it. So, I don't know if I have a whole lot more to say right now because, you know, didn't have time to do any research or anything.
The takes were hot people. The takes were hot.
came right off the presses. We literally just got home and delivered it to you.
Yep. So again, I probably won't see it at the theater again. And as I said, it's not, you know, going to be my favorite Marvel movie and it's not my least favorite. So I think Anthony Mackie did a good job. think Sam as Captain America did a good job. I really liked Joaquin as the new Falcon. I like that character. I'm glad they brought him back. So I think they've got
Rebecca (:My least favorite.
Tori (:some strong things to build on.
Yeah, I agree. And it's interesting, we know, we saw several previews during, we know that Bucky will be part of the Red Guardian and Black Widow Sister, what are they, the Unforgettables?
you
Shame gang, what is that?
They're all black windows.
Rebecca (:No, movie that's coming out with Red Guardian and Bucky. Thunderbolts!
Asterisk. Thunderbolt's asterisk. And I'm like, what is the asterisk for? It's driving me kind of crazy. I'm like, what's the asterisk? Yeah, so it should be interesting. They're really laying the stage here for the upcoming Avengers, the new Avengers stuff. And oh, and I did want to say the prosthetics on Tim Blake Nelson were really nice.
Good question.
Rebecca (:Yeah, I liked his eye.
that was crazy. I wonder if that was CG or if it was a contact. I mean, do you think that was like his whole head makeup? Do you think that was a prosthetic? I thought so. That's what I thought too. It looked practical.
Yeah, I think the glowy business was probably enhanced. But I feel like, you know, just looking at him, a lot of that was practical, but, but we don't know. We need to find out more.
Probably CG, yeah.
Tori (:We do. We do. And I know there's probably a ton of Easter eggs I miss, looking forward to getting a breakdown from one of my YouTube peoples. Yeah. Eric Voss, please. Thank you.
Yeah, definitely. But yeah, I would say we both enjoyed it. Yeah, yeah. It's not like, my gosh, this is the best thing ever, but boy, it's far from the worst.
Yeah, think, I don't know if it's gonna get, I think it's probably gonna take a bunch of hits.
Yeah, probably. I'd be interested in what our listeners' experiences when they go to see it. Feel free to email us at wittstvpod at gmail.com. I was surprised there weren't more people in the theater. I mean, it opened last week.
Weird time. Yeah, it did open last night. But it was a weird time of day too. I mean, it wasn't like early afternoon and it wasn't quite late afternoon.
Rebecca (:I know, you know, Oppenheimer and Barbie, you know, I mean, if it was a barn burner, I think there would have been more people there. I mean, I didn't feel like it was well attended at all, our show.
No, it wasn't. wasn't. I hope that's not... God. I hope it's not, like, a sign of the times.
No. Yeah. I hope not either. And I did feel I was moved by the moment when Captain America is in the hospital room with Falcon and I can't remember exactly what he said, but it was something that made me think he was speaking more than just.
not being Captain America, but he had to be better than good, And again, representing and not looking like Captain America and like, sorry, like Steve Rogers, right? So it was touching. It was a touching moment. And I think then the Falcon kind of reciprocated that a little bit when he was talking about
his upbringing and everything. anyway.
Tori (:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that's kind of a continuation from the Falcon and the Winter Soldier. I mean, there was a lot of that in that television series. Yeah. So I think it's worth a see. Yeah. Got anything else? I don't think so. All right. Well, then all we have to do is say goodbye.
Agreed. So.
Rebecca (:Thanks for listening, everybody.
Mo (:Wallowing in the Shallows is created and produced by the both of us, edited by Mo. The soundtracks for the Wallowing and the Shallows Marvel Edition are Apache Rock Instrumental by SoundAtelier, available on jamendo.com, and the Epical Trailer by The Mountain on pixabay.com. You can send us feedback at witstvpod at gmail.com.
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